Timeline for A way to fight back the meeting-bongo, how dangerous is this idea?
Current License: CC BY-SA 4.0
24 events
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| Jun 28, 2021 at 19:04 | comment | added | computercarguy | @TooTea, you are still missing an important point: the manager will understand that a meeting is pointless/unproductive to you. They may have been at that same meeting and thought it was great/informative, while it has nothing to do with the OP. The employee is always responsible for letting management know when their skills and (especially) time are wasted. That often means more than just another line item on a timesheet. That means talking directly to the manager, either F2F, email, or something else specifically states that X meetings are not relevant to them, or whatever the case may be. | |
| Jun 28, 2021 at 18:57 | comment | added | computercarguy | @ToddWilcox, I never said a paper trail is bad, I just said that only having a paper trail and not following up on it is bad. Too many manager don't really look at calendars. They assume that everything is "just fine", until it isn't. The employee needs to bring it to the manager's attention, instead of assuming the manager will notice. You remember that little phrase about ASSuMEing things, right? | |
| Jun 28, 2021 at 13:26 | comment | added | Gray Sheep | @thieupepijn Bosses are very accurate here to track the papers related to us. Partially because also the Customers are likely very accurate to check the invoices of the company. They talk only a little about this, and this can a not enough experienced employee to think, that they are watching only superficially. But not. This silent, but close watching is a custom, what I faced only in Germany. Other countries are really sloppy (more clearly, what they check, is the result and not the details). | |
| Jun 28, 2021 at 8:17 | comment | added | Chris H | @njzk2 not only does this assume a timesheet, it assumes a timesheet that logs work types. Everywhere I've worked with timesheets, they've only logged which project I spent my time on, so actively designing, meetings, background research etc. would be indistinguishable. | |
| Jun 27, 2021 at 16:30 | comment | added | Cris | I don't get why OP accepted an answer which essentially just tells you to give up and solves nothing... | |
| Jun 27, 2021 at 14:26 | comment | added | Agustín Lado | I don't get it, what kind of managers do people have? Why is even bringing up what you think is a possible issue trying to do the best for the company something to fear? That is usually a good thing, not the other way around! | |
| Jun 27, 2021 at 0:59 | comment | added | Todd Wilcox | @computercarguy I am a manager. As such I already know how productive my team is and how meetings waste their time. I know that because I look at their calendars! The reason why I like this answer is that a “paper trail” is a powerful thing making one is almost always a good first step in building awareness and a foundation for change. | |
| Jun 26, 2021 at 21:17 | comment | added | njzk2 | assuming you have a timesheet | |
| Jun 26, 2021 at 19:15 | comment | added | TooTea | @computercarguy Pointless meetings and too many meetings are two completely separate issues. I'm only talking about addressing the latter. I have edited the answer to clarify this. | |
| Jun 26, 2021 at 19:12 | history | edited | TooTea | CC BY-SA 4.0 |
added 339 characters in body
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| Jun 26, 2021 at 17:35 | comment | added | computercarguy | @TooTea, yes, the manager will talk to you, probably with an ultimatum in hand. They will hold those meetings against you, even though they weren't your idea and you don't want to go to them, but if you don't bring it up to the manager's attention that they aren't productive to you, it'll be your fault anyway for not being proactive, or something. And because they have an ultimatum, anything else they hold you accountable for later on can be used to boot you out the door. And yes, I've been fired for things I wasn't responsible for. | |
| Jun 26, 2021 at 17:31 | comment | added | computercarguy | @ToddWilcox, putting the meetings on a calendar is standard and should be done. However, just "going with the flow" and not speaking out against the meetings that are unnecessary for you is not a good thing. Managers want you to be productive, and if the meetings aren't productive for you and is actively hurting your productivity in a way they want, then they need to know about it before it becomes a problem, and they aren't going to find out about it from the people running the meetings, since they think it's "obviously" productive to every attendee. | |
| Jun 26, 2021 at 12:25 | comment | added | TooTea | @computercarguy Presumably, said managers will discuss the perceived lack of productivity with you long before resorting to fire you, won't they? | |
| Jun 26, 2021 at 12:21 | comment | added | TooTea | @DonQuiKong I'm sorry if it came across as supporting OP's "public calendar plan", that was very much not my intention. (I think that's a terrible idea.) I have edited the answer to clarify. | |
| Jun 26, 2021 at 12:18 | history | edited | TooTea | CC BY-SA 4.0 |
Adjusted in response to clarifications by the OP
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| Jun 26, 2021 at 7:31 | comment | added | Todd Wilcox | @computercarguy I wonder if there's a cultural difference going on in this Q&A because in the USA, saying you're in meetings all the time is something that most people do at many jobs and then laugh about it. I'm very confused by all the "don't put your meetings on your calendar" answers because if I don't put meetings on my calendar I miss them! I need the calendar reminders to make sure I am at the meeting! Where I've worked, not having all of your meetings on your calendar is considered a problem, and calendar invites are sent to everyone for meetings they are asked to attend. | |
| Jun 26, 2021 at 3:07 | comment | added | BSMP | We have a very detailed work log. I just log and go on. @GraySheep If this is something you're already doing then why were you concerned that someone might complain about you not getting work done? I don't think this is a bad idea on its own but it's unclear how it solves your problem if the situation hasn't changed. | |
| Jun 25, 2021 at 23:20 | comment | added | computercarguy | In general, this is a great way to get fired for not completing assignments. Saying you're in meetings all the time is rarely a good defense, at least not to managers. | |
| Jun 25, 2021 at 20:22 | comment | added | DonQuiKong | This is only the accepted answer because it's basically what you suggested @GraySheep just in other words. Don't ask questions if all you want is confirmation. | |
| Jun 25, 2021 at 16:11 | comment | added | David R | @GraySheep Actually, this is part of the reason for being an employee: to spend a lot of time in meetings. Your job is not just to be a programmer, it is also to be a meeting listener. So, make sure that your boss knows how much time you are in meetings and let your boss decide if that is what helps the company the most. | |
| Jun 25, 2021 at 15:08 | vote | accept | Gray Sheep | ||
| Jun 25, 2021 at 15:08 | comment | added | Gray Sheep | I think you are right, exactly this should be done. We have a very detailed work log. I just log and go on. The calendar trick is unneeded, it is already logged, from that point it is up to them, how do they calculate (and optimize) the work effectivity of the team. | |
| Jun 25, 2021 at 14:56 | comment | added | thieupepijn | Like I argued in my own answer I think the OP should take a little more initiative than just filling in the timesheets and hope someone higher-up notices and takes action. | |
| Jun 25, 2021 at 11:30 | history | answered | TooTea | CC BY-SA 4.0 |