Timeline for Is it unethical to say my current employer has financial problems when looking for another job?
Current License: CC BY-SA 3.0
15 events
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| Jun 16, 2020 at 10:59 | history | edited | CommunityBot |
Commonmark migration
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| May 18, 2016 at 9:21 | vote | accept | Joudicek Jouda | ||
| May 17, 2016 at 15:23 | comment | added | Jonathan Vanasco | @JuhaUntinen Nothing. That's actually the typical strategy in America for lowers earners to "break out". If someone is lucky, they work with a recruiter who will maximize their take-home by sharing what the employer would pay -- and might be able to raise to (though most are trying to close the deal as cheap/fast as possible). Very rarely, an employer might use presenting false compensation as grounds for termination without benefits (this only happens when the employer is actively trying to fire someone) - so the status-quo is to talk about the value of "total compensation" in general terms. | |
| May 16, 2016 at 23:10 | comment | added | Juha Untinen |
@JonathanVanasco: What stops candidates from saying desired salary - 10% instead of their real previous salary, which could be eg. desired salary - 30%? Then the HR will probably approve the desired salary AKA 10% more than your so-called previous salary. It's a win-win: The candidate gets what they want and HR is happy that they got the candidate for just "10%" more. It's probably for this reason that in Finland, everyone just asks for your desired salary and never your previous salary (which btw is publicly available via yearly tax statistics).
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| May 16, 2016 at 22:56 | comment | added | DarcyThomas | I wouldn't say anything about wanting to start a family. Although they shouldn't hiring managers can sometimes discriminate based on that knowledge. Easer just leaving that info out of the conversation. | |
| May 16, 2016 at 20:15 | comment | added | Jonathan Vanasco | @Wildcard I agree with all of that... however most HR departments will insist, and jr/mid-level applicant's often provide. My original comment in this discussion, which resonates with your remarks, is that an applicant should never state they make "significantly below market" (or an actual number) because that puts them at a disadvantage. If salary is a motivation, they should simply talk about it not being competitive, and reference their target compensation. | |
| May 16, 2016 at 19:53 | comment | added | Wildcard | @JonathanVanasco, very few people are good at negotiation. But no one is in any way obliged to provide their salary history, and doing so before receiving an actual numerical offer simply puts the applicant at a disadvantage. Also this question is very relevant. | |
| May 16, 2016 at 17:41 | comment | added | Jonathan Vanasco | @Dank In every NYC industry I know of and have worked with (and hired in), it is both common and expected for the HR department to request the current salary. In my experience, very few people will reply "that is irrelevant". I agree that HR basing offers on previous salaries should not be the case -- and most forward thinking managers do too -- but that is the status quo... even among companies that are consistently ranked as "best to work for!". | |
| May 16, 2016 at 17:34 | comment | added | Jonathan Vanasco | @DanK I agree it is fine to admit the primary driver is compensation, but how you present this fact is very important. Saying "my salary isn't competitive" is entirely different than saying "I'm being paid significantly under market average". Your statement can be interpreted as "I'm making just-below market rate" or "I'm a high performer who should be paid at the upper end of market rate"; a hiring manager initially feels they must beat market rate to retain you. The OP's statement will essentially interpreted as "Ok. so we just offer the low-end of market rate and they're better off." 1/2 | |
| May 16, 2016 at 16:05 | comment | added | user48276 | @JonathanVanasco My experience has been entirely opposite. I came into my current position and was very clear with my new company that my motivation for leaving was that my previous salary wasn't competitive. Not only were they satisfied with that answer but I know that information factored into the amount of their offer. No one should be ashamed of admitting that their primary driver for employment is compensation. If an HR dept is basing offers solely on previous salaries then they are doing it wrong and you really don't want to work at a place like that. | |
| May 16, 2016 at 15:46 | comment | added | Jonathan Vanasco | You should never say that you are paid "significantly below the market average". Many HR departments and hiring managers work with the mindset of offering people incremental raises over past salary, very few are willing to base salaries off of what an employee is worth (many recent studies have shown this is a primary cause of the gap in wages across genders). That comment immediately tells them they can negotiate with you for "take it or leave it" below-market salary offerings - and most will. | |
| May 16, 2016 at 11:07 | comment | added | Patricia Shanahan | If the employer's financial problems are generally known, the phrasing in this answer will be interpreted as getting out for that reason. If not, saying anything about the financial problems will be interpreted as "Cannot be trusted with confidential information." | |
| May 16, 2016 at 10:27 | comment | added | Philip Kendall | You should never say anything about your employer which isn't already in the public domain. | |
| May 16, 2016 at 10:23 | comment | added | Joudicek Jouda | Good point! That may work! But still back to the original question: If I'm asked to speak about my previous employer in more details is it considered unethical to say he has a financial problems? I really don't know.. | |
| May 16, 2016 at 10:08 | history | answered | Philip Kendall | CC BY-SA 3.0 |